Barren Lands track created by me gets an amazing addition and inputs by none other than Pan65!
Merging and mixing of 2 genres, language and sounds!
Vocals & Lyrics by : Pan65
Final track mixing : Pan65
Pan65 soundcloud profile : @pan65
Watching Waiting for Something
Waiting, longing, dreaming, needing
Aching, dying, screaming and crying
Shaking, freezing, choking, drowning
Bleeding, suffer, fading away
So shake me… break me… wake me… bring me to life…
Vad väntar vi på? (Swedish)
हम किस लिए रुके हैं? (Hama kisa li'ē rukē haiṁ?) (Hindi)
What are we waiting for? (English)
Kion ni atendas? (Esperanto)
Nice work and change-up of moods. Smooth pad sounds, and I like the FM-style bell pad.
Good blend! Nice to hear Pan's voice.
Wow, more Caustic vocals! First Skarabee and now Pan
I can see the Audio track/rack for Caustic 3.x becoming top of peoples 'I would like' list
Love it, I'm knocked out every day by this forum and the talent on display
wonderful collaboration... like it very much.. winu
Nice work guys! Brilliant!!!
awsome track..vocals are cool...great mood.
Thanks Guys! All cheers to Pan65 for creating an amazing part and he worked a lot on this track as far as mixing is concerned!
Pan65 did they know about the thing you did?
By the way my favorite part is his whispering vocals and guitar solo!!! WOW.
EP Album 'Oblivion Messages Out Now'
Why so modest Nishit? You did a great job on this too, without your part this track would not exist. It was very nice working with you and I really appreciate the dialog we had during the process. I think both you and I learned a lot from this experience, I got loads of ideas for future tracks sprung from this project. Some of them involves our little easter-egg we put in there, I don’t think anyone spotted it yet soo…
Guys ‘n’ Gals! If you can spot anything really special about this track I will reveal how it’s done. I will even provide a tool to make it easier to produce this “effect”. It’s probably not that easy to hear this one if you don’t now it’s in there but give it a try and I promise it will be worth your while
ok ill guess...it has something to do with the length of the vocal track....maybe you give us a hint.?
No the vocals are chopped to fit in a pcm so there's no magic there, what you are looking for is not a sound you can hear but part of the track anyway:-)
Hmmmmn, some kind of multi audio channel simulation? I can't think of any standard studio effect that Caustic doesn't have.
I'm thinking of things like Q-sound and modern 5.1 emulation.
Well it is possible to emulate 3D-like effects with only two channels. You could for example make a smooth pan from left to right while you increase/decrease the level of the sound. If you do these automations in a sinus-like motion you create the illusion of something moving in a circular path in front of you.
But the effect we put I there got nothing to do with that, it’s more fundamental in it's nature and you need to ‘tap’ in deeper to detect it
Stereo samples? Although that can now be achieved with two mono samples in PCM, or even BB if you don't need to play them at more than one pitch.
Timestretch? That's one that I'm not sure you can do with the wav editor yet?
Ha ha, I would say we did succeed if it is so hard to hear it. I left a little clue in my previous post. It got nothing to do with samples or the wave-editor but time-stretching is close…
Something is making me guess that it was the treatment/production on the vocals though...so maybe some subtle vocoder effects, maybe emulating pitchshifting...
umm..how about using the tap tempo to change the time signature....
though im not sure how that could be done
you could do it if you were playing the arranged track and then recording straight from the audio jack . I can see that Pan would know a number of ways to do this and I know Mike records audio live when he's playing around.
If so, the tempo change would be between the intro and middle section and again for the end section?
With a PC you used to get the option to record 'what you can hear' with the software supplied with some soundcards...
Yeah now it’s really hot, compare the tempo between Nishit’s first part and my part. It’s not a big change but you hear it if you know there is a difference. Nishit’s part runs at 120 bpm and my part is 135 bpm.
If anyone is interested I write a tutorial on the subject...
I would be interested how you managed it so seamlessly, especially if you did it all in C3 and just recorded live.
Did you have a sample that bridged the tempo change to give you time to make the change without producing a lot of audio artefacts?
If you had a sample with no effects or recorded with effects already added, you would probably avoid most of the artefacts you get when changing tempo.
No there are no overdubbing involved, all is done in the sequencer. Have a look at the caustic file, I removed Zvon’s samples from it but the rest of the track is intact.
Caustic Song file (optional):
cool,..i would be interested in how you did it.
Looks like it involved some math to work out the note placement if I understand what you did correctly, the first section is recorded in the piano roll, the 2nd section is recorded in pattern editor and I'm guessing that you utilised the more free form format of the piano roll to effectively combine the two different tempos
I'm surprised the closing section is in the pattern editor as it sounds like a reprise of Nishit's opening part and I thought they were the same tempo...
ok so what if you import the midi file of nishit's part at a lower tempo say 105 bpm,...then build "pans part" on top of that at 135,..which would add 15 bpms to nishits part in the final mix making his part now 120. ...oh wait that wont work...will it?
Well I’m a lazy guy so I did chose to alter Nishit’s part since it had less notes to work with.
No it doesen’t work, caustic don’t handle tempo changes even if you import a midi file with such changes. As James say this is done by calculating the start and end of each note, then you have to go off-grid and insert the notes by hand. Yeah I know it’s hard work but that’s the only way to do it at the moment. I made a excel document to do the calculations and I will make it public soon but I need to write instructions for it first. It may take a few days since I’m quite busy at the moment, but I’ll post it along with the file when I’m done.
Did you have to go down to 64th interval then? You can't actually place sounds that don't snap to a grid unless you're recording live without quantisation can you?
wow, seems like a time consuming process...the results are pretty cool though.
This is awesome. Love the lead section with the Serge Gainsbourg wispers. So good, I wish you had some more.
Wait, changing tempo on-the-fly is possible in Caustic?.... Edit: nevermind... I read a few prior posts and this question was answered. I saw mention of tempo change and immediately skipped what I later saw were relevant follow-up posts. Sorry. Just a bit bummed it's not really possible without doing the math. If changing tempo and Timestretching were possible in Caustic I probably wouldn't ever use another DAW on any platform for quite some time...
VIOLENT NEUROSIS (YouTube) ...https://www.youtube.com/user/ViolentNeurosis
wow very cool guys....great collab....love it...
ha man...sounds like hard work for the tempo change...but very inventive too...
you guys are awesome...
james: think you press on the quantise button in the pattern editor?....remember accidentally pressing it once....
My name is quokka on soundcloud:
that's for recording live without quantise on isn't it?
I guess my point was more...if each note is placed in the Piano roll in the sequencer screen and this a different tempo to the earlier part of the track, did Pan have to set the interval to 64ths so that he could place each note exactly where it needed to be, in order to keep his part in time with itself.
Or am I over thinking it
Great collaboration work guys, sounding very unique. Interesting technique to achieve the tempo change, which I assume requires a lot of patience!
i checked...u can use the Q.TIZE (ahem Q.TISE!!) button anytime in the pattern editor....
i just skimmed the technical descriptions above....but imagine that 64ths would have gotten him close to the desired position....then some extra shifting/stretching without snap to grid would've been necessary for the extra decimal places...i guess he could've been lazy and missed a few and we wouldn't notice...then again maybe pan65 put a ruler on his phone/tablet screen and lined it up perfectly :)
My name is quokka on soundcloud:
Well it was my intention to write a short tutorial on the subject but I forgot all about it. I'm afraid I lost the Excel file in a nasty harddrive crash (the blasted laptop gets to hot and shut it self down every now and then), maybe I can make a new one but that's not really necessary since the math is quite simple :).
If you divide the original tempo with the new tempo you get a factor you can multiply the start and end time of each note with. As you guys already guessed you need to unquantisize to place the notes where they should be and to stretch them into size. You don't need to be very accurate while doing this, a little "humanizeing" is nice to hear but prepare to place the notes within a 10'th of the gridsize you work with.
It doesn't hurt to be a little smart and plan it well before you get in to it, the reason I chosed Nishit's part to change is simply because it had less notes to alter :).
Let me know if you need help, I can put together a new Excel document if needed or maybe I make an app to make the hard work for you.