That would probably be me then, since I'm at the bottom of this food chain heehee.... If I play my cards right, will have the final song uploaded and video completed ready to rock simultaneously.
bidzo, rename the file to CommunityJam1_01.caustic please, then upload again. Ifwe don't name the files like this I am going to have a bunch of nameing collisions on the server and end up with weird names for the future.
Question to the whole crue: If we want to target a complete track runtime of 3-5 minutes, and the first upload is 15 seconds, (who knows how long future submissions will be, but anyways), then are we all thinking that Jason is going to slice, dice, and arrange really nice the various pieces to build the thing up to our target time?
As I understood, we needed to make our tracks 3 minutes long each.
Jason is going to master, not mix or automate our tracks. So I think the rule is, we can make as many patterns as we want, just sequence in the song sequencer and do any automation needed add effects. I think having Jason focus on the whole blanace in the mixer and master is what track 15 does.
Then I need to ask Warrior bidzo to resubmit his track, with at least 3 minutes (or more) worth of patterns loaded in the sequencer.
Bidzo, you wrote a good hook. It's already stuck in my head for the day. Now you just need to create some variations and play around with song arrangement. I don't think you need to fill the entire 3 minutes with patterns, but at least place patterns in the sequencer so that the song will play for 3 minutes or more before starting over (or ending).
What? what? I can't automate? creating proper balance on some things may require it, at least in the main Mixer and Master racks... somebody better set my boundries now, because I will go in deep to make a final song sound good.....
Jason, you can automate the 15th track which is the mixer and master.
I thought the point of this excersise was to put 15 flavors in a song and see how it comes out. I respect your mastering abilitites thus you have all reign on the levels, mixer, balance but I think letting the others add what they feel for song automation.effect in their own track is fair.
I think mike is correct, we wanted to see how each individuals contribution works together. Each person does there own patterns, effects, and automation. Jason's role is to bring it all together as best he can using the mixers and mastering screens.
However, if Jason is up for it, I'd be interested in hearing both versions. The one where each member does his own stuff, and the one where Jason can do whatever he wants with everyone's stuff (but all of everyone's pattern must appear in the final mix).
You can either do more to reach the 180 second mark, or you can call it good, and the next person will start. If you want to go with what you have, then after 35 seconds into the song have passed we won't hear anymore of your machine's patterns. Is that what you want to do?
We just want to target 3 minute minimum for the track length.
Hey that's cool. I DON'T want to step on anybodys' toes..... so you better lay down the rules for me, because you know I will tear it all down to the bones....
I'll be a good boy and follow whatever the rules for me are.
Things that I would want access to:
1. the ability to go in an tweak line levels of individual samples (i.e. drums) for balance
2. adjust static EQ's for mix balance
3. adjust Master Reverb and Delay Sends and wet levels for global balance
Coolbeans..... I want to make this bout you guys, not me..... I just wanna make it all sound good, and show the world how fun and easy it is to do this as a community -- no other app can even come close to touching this.
Gotta go to dental cleaning now, catch y'alls later
I think that's fair and square, maybe we should add to the rules that every one has to leave at least one FX-slot. That way Jason get the ability to add a highpass or whatever he needs to clean the mix.
I think allowing Jason to automate a little might be necessary for a final mixdown. Things like volume automation are generally necessary dont you think J?
In general a mastering engineer's job is to make a track sound louder and fuller without destroying the dynamics and feel of the piece. I trust J wont do that if given a little freedom with automation.
I was just thinking after this project is complete we could allow remixes from all users by posting the final .caustic file.
question 1. why not just allow people to use whatever effects they want then give jason the discretion to change the effects if nessicary....my reasoning is that some sounds require 2 insert effects to sound good. but if jason sees a better way to achieve a better sounding mix he should be able to modify change or remove effects as needed.
2.are we waiting till its our turn before we work on our part?
3. arent we putting alot of control on the first person in the list as they are essentially going to dictate the underlying chord structure and general cadence of the track...no offence to bidzo but pehaps it might be a fair to vote on who should be the one set the chord structure and song structure...or perhaps draw straws (metaphor for pick a number)...because as it stand now...its bidzo's song and we are just adding bits and pieces to it...unless i have it wrong.
I think for this session, we wait until it is our turn. We can use different rules next time around.
I like the "each member can use 2 effects and Jason can tweak it later" proposal better than having just one effect to use.
I don't want to put too many constraints on this because as we do that we move further from what could have been each individual's unique contribution. Again, at least for this session. Sound good?
OK hands up I have already started to have a fiddle with what bidzo has put out there.
It strikes me that when I have had a jam with others somebody usually comes out with a riff that sets some form of structure. Half the joy of jamming is taking what is there and adding stuff with your own particular spin. If you stay in key, maybe you can work out another layer of sounds that change the underlying chord structure. It may be my complete musical ineptitude but I normally start a track with a bassline and beat, Chord structure tends to come when I am thinking about pads or skanky rythms.
I might go back and tweak parts as I add more on, and that is where I think it gets really difficult, particularly in arrangement here. How would people feel about having their track tweaked a little in the sequencer to make space as long as all the patterns are still used. Maybe people could say as they post their part up any specific requirements or ideas that they had in mind when making their track as in:-
I wrote this so that pattern one moves into pattern two and must go together but patterns three and four are interchangeable and as for number five it is like a wild card in poker, chuck it in anywhere it's needed, and if things are getting too crowded you can drop it alltogether.
That way you would still show off what you can do, but everyone who works on the track has a bit of flexibility in making space for themselves and their ideas. Maybe as we get toward the end people could have a final chance to tweak their part in the light of what others have done?
Listen people, I said in the beginning we needed rules or structure, simplistic stuff. I have had a lot pf experience with blind faith and internet web community development and in the past things go off the rails when people think to much.
What I am saying is, the first challenge to this community is just finishing ONE collaborative track. What comes next is called iterative refactoring.
I have spent years understanding what makes a good application tick, you want to know the answer? Flexibility and knowing everything will change iterativly as the design progresses.
Right now, we need not focus on semantics of music but just slapping out each track to the best of your ability and pass it on like a hot potato.
Once this first iteration is done, you will see and probably have a huge new view of how to add more expression and musical semantics like you want right now in the design flow.
It seems what we all really want here is a great sounding track. But for this session, I echo mike's statement of doing your best when its your turn and passing it on like a hot potato. Once we have collectively conpleted the project, then we can have an after-action review and discuss it all.
Regarding Jasons permissions to "play" with insert effects I would say everyone should be free to use both effect slots because sometimes you only get the sound you want if you use two effects.
But what can Jason do? He should only take hands on those "effects" which don't change the sound but tweak only the signal. And that are in my eyes only Compressor, Limiter and Parametric Eqalizer.
If an effect slot is free, he can use one of the three.
If one of the three is already there, he can tweak it.
And Mike, I see your concerns are not as strict as you. Even if this project doesn't run in the direction as we assume, so what...
We just want to have fun and we all can learn about it for the next time.
I guess it will be a nice experience for everyone because here are professional and non-professional musician (as me).
> And Mike, I see your concerns are not as strict as you. Even if this project doesn't run in the direction as we assume, so what...
Is this a positive or negative comment? It is getting lost in translation with me.
FYI: I am(or caustic transformer) is updating the MAIN thread with the file and date completed of each track, so check the first post in this thing for the current files and who has the potato. I will keep updating it as people submit the .caustic file.
Don't forget to send me pics or photos of you working on your tracks..... The more I get from you guys, the more I can add to the video version of the final product.
I'm working on a track myself..... Just messin' around with some other stuff while I keep my third eye on this thread...
I wrote this because of my understanding of your previous comments.
I guess you are concerned that we will be at each other's throats if we do not agree each other and the project will fail. I think you see it too much from a professional view and your focus is to make it perfect.
>I guess you are concerned that we will be at each other's throats if we do not agree each other and the project will fail. I think you see it too much from a professional view and your focus is to make it perfect.
I think that won't be a problem because we all stay skinny cause we just won't eat (and if we are sooooo skinny there's space enough in th tub...)
https://soundcloud.com/gharwen
Yea, i'll bathe later...
ＭＹ ＭＵＳＩＣ
ok o'm gonna start now :)
sorry guys i live in greece and i'm posting comments very late :(
i hope my part will aproach youre expectation :) # updated # :) now it is 1:14 min
Caustic Song file (optional):
That would probably be me then, since I'm at the bottom of this food chain heehee.... If I play my cards right, will have the final song uploaded and video completed ready to rock simultaneously.
Alright, CausticReplay, you're up next--
bidzo, rename the file to CommunityJam1_01.caustic please, then upload again. If we don't name the files like this I am going to have a bunch of nameing collisions on the server and end up with weird names for the future.
Mike
Question to the whole crue: If we want to target a complete track runtime of 3-5 minutes, and the first upload is 15 seconds, (who knows how long future submissions will be, but anyways), then are we all thinking that Jason is going to slice, dice, and arrange really nice the various pieces to build the thing up to our target time?
Google Play! | Facebook | YouTube!
As I understood, we needed to make our tracks 3 minutes long each.
Jason is going to master, not mix or automate our tracks. So I think the rule is, we can make as many patterns as we want, just sequence in the song sequencer and do any automation needed add effects. I think having Jason focus on the whole blanace in the mixer and master is what track 15 does.
Mike
Then I need to ask Warrior bidzo to resubmit his track, with at least 3 minutes (or more) worth of patterns loaded in the sequencer.
Bidzo, you wrote a good hook. It's already stuck in my head for the day.
Now you just need to create some variations and play around with song arrangement. I don't think you need to fill the entire 3 minutes with patterns, but at least place patterns in the sequencer so that the song will play for 3 minutes or more before starting over (or ending).
Google Play! | Facebook | YouTube!
I think as people add to the song, perhaps they can copy/paste patterns from other machines to help fill in the gaps?
is there any room left?
I'll take what ever spot is left over
What? what? I can't automate?
creating proper balance on some things may require it, at least in the main Mixer and Master racks... somebody better set my boundries now, because I will go in deep to make a final song sound good.....
Jason, you can automate the 15th track which is the mixer and master.
I thought the point of this excersise was to put 15 flavors in a song and see how it comes out. I respect your mastering abilitites thus you have all reign on the levels, mixer, balance but I think letting the others add what they feel for song automation.effect in their own track is fair.
Do you agree or not?
Mike
i did 35 second :D need more? i'll doi it ;)
I think mike is correct, we wanted to see how each individuals contribution works together. Each person does there own patterns, effects, and automation. Jason's role is to bring it all together as best he can using the mixers and mastering screens.
However, if Jason is up for it, I'd be interested in hearing both versions. The one where each member does his own stuff, and the one where Jason can do whatever he wants with everyone's stuff (but all of everyone's pattern must appear in the final mix).
Agreed?
Google Play! | Facebook | YouTube!
The rack is full wardini.
If somebody backs out, you get dibs on their old spot.
Assuming we try this again, you are #1 in line for that roster. Sound good?
Google Play! | Facebook | YouTube!
You can either do more to reach the 180 second mark, or you can call it good, and the next person will start. If you want to go with what you have, then after 35 seconds into the song have passed we won't hear anymore of your machine's patterns. Is that what you want to do?
We just want to target 3 minute minimum for the track length.
Google Play! | Facebook | YouTube!
Hey that's cool. I DON'T want to step on anybodys' toes..... so you better lay down the rules for me, because you know I will tear it all down to the bones....
I'll be a good boy and follow whatever the rules for me are.
Things that I would want access to:
1. the ability to go in an tweak line levels of individual samples (i.e. drums) for balance
2. adjust static EQ's for mix balance
3. adjust Master Reverb and Delay Sends and wet levels for global balance
4. feed a homeless cat
Jason, this is what we thought you were going to do. The cat is up to you.
Mike
Coolbeans..... I want to make this bout you guys, not me..... I just wanna make it all sound good, and show the world how fun and easy it is to do this as a community -- no other app can even come close to touching this.
Gotta go to dental cleaning now, catch y'alls later
I think that's fair and square, maybe we should add to the rules that every one has to leave at least one FX-slot. That way Jason get the ability to add a highpass or whatever he needs to clean the mix.
I think allowing Jason to automate a little might be necessary for a final mixdown. Things like volume automation are generally necessary dont you think J?
In general a mastering engineer's job is to make a track sound louder and fuller without destroying the dynamics and feel of the piece. I trust J wont do that if given a little freedom with automation.
I was just thinking after this project is complete we could allow remixes from all users by posting the final .caustic file.
ok i updated my part and now it is your turn ;)
+1
This is the time the night and the year
Everyone cool with just 1 effects slot? Sounds fair to me.
Google Play! | Facebook | YouTube!
question 1. why not just allow people to use whatever effects they want then give jason the discretion to change the effects if nessicary....my reasoning is that some sounds require 2 insert effects to sound good. but if jason sees a better way to achieve a better sounding mix he should be able to modify change or remove effects as needed.
2.are we waiting till its our turn before we work on our part?
3. arent we putting alot of control on the first person in the list as they are essentially going to dictate the underlying chord structure and general cadence of the track...no offence to bidzo but pehaps it might be a fair to vote on who should be the one set the chord structure and song structure...or perhaps draw straws (metaphor for pick a number)...because as it stand now...its bidzo's song and we are just adding bits and pieces to it...unless i have it wrong.
I think for this session, we wait until it is our turn. We can use different rules next time around.
I like the "each member can use 2 effects and Jason can tweak it later" proposal better than having just one effect to use.
I don't want to put too many constraints on this because as we do that we move further from what could have been each individual's unique contribution. Again, at least for this session. Sound good?
Google Play! | Facebook | YouTube!
ok cool.
OK hands up I have already started to have a fiddle with what bidzo has put out there.
It strikes me that when I have had a jam with others somebody usually comes out with a riff that sets some form of structure. Half the joy of jamming is taking what is there and adding stuff with your own particular spin. If you stay in key, maybe you can work out another layer of sounds that change the underlying chord structure. It may be my complete musical ineptitude but I normally start a track with a bassline and beat, Chord structure tends to come when I am thinking about pads or skanky rythms.
I might go back and tweak parts as I add more on, and that is where I think it gets really difficult, particularly in arrangement here. How would people feel about having their track tweaked a little in the sequencer to make space as long as all the patterns are still used. Maybe people could say as they post their part up any specific requirements or ideas that they had in mind when making their track as in:-
I wrote this so that pattern one moves into pattern two and must go together but patterns three and four are interchangeable and as for number five it is like a wild card in poker, chuck it in anywhere it's needed, and if things are getting too crowded you can drop it alltogether.
That way you would still show off what you can do, but everyone who works on the track has a bit of flexibility in making space for themselves and their ideas. Maybe as we get toward the end people could have a final chance to tweak their part in the light of what others have done?
Have a little listen to my work.
https://soundcloud.com/drbolus
https://www.facebook.com/drbolus
Listen people, I said in the beginning we needed rules or structure, simplistic stuff. I have had a lot pf experience with blind faith and internet web community development and in the past things go off the rails when people think to much.
What I am saying is, the first challenge to this community is just finishing ONE collaborative track. What comes next is called iterative refactoring.
I have spent years understanding what makes a good application tick, you want to know the answer? Flexibility and knowing everything will change iterativly as the design progresses.
Right now, we need not focus on semantics of music but just slapping out each track to the best of your ability and pass it on like a hot potato.
Once this first iteration is done, you will see and probably have a huge new view of how to add more expression and musical semantics like you want right now in the design flow.
Jut do it! :)
Mike
Just to be annoying and Old Fail
Have a little listen to my work.
https://soundcloud.com/drbolus
https://www.facebook.com/drbolus
It seems what we all really want here is a great sounding track. But for this session, I echo mike's statement of doing your best when its your turn and passing it on like a hot potato. Once we have collectively conpleted the project, then we can have an after-action review and discuss it all.
Google Play! | Facebook | YouTube!
I agree with Mike, just concentrate on your machine and how it fits into what has already been done. We can worry about remixes later.
Thanks bidzo. I'll try to start later tonight (preparing for tomorrow's Holiday dinner in one hand and monitoring this thread in the other).
Google Play! | Facebook | YouTube!
Regarding Jasons permissions to "play" with insert effects I would say everyone should be free to use both effect slots because sometimes you only get the sound you want if you use two effects.
But what can Jason do? He should only take hands on those "effects" which don't change the sound but tweak only the signal. And that are in my eyes only Compressor, Limiter and Parametric Eqalizer.
And Mike, I see your concerns are not as strict as you. Even if this project doesn't run in the direction as we assume, so what...
We just want to have fun and we all can learn about it for the next time.
I guess it will be a nice experience for everyone because here are professional and non-professional musician (as me).
https://soundcloud.com/gharwen
> And Mike, I see your concerns are not as strict as you. Even if this project doesn't run in the direction as we assume, so what...
Is this a positive or negative comment? It is getting lost in translation with me.
FYI: I am(or caustic transformer) is updating the MAIN thread with the file and date completed of each track, so check the first post in this thing for the current files and who has the potato. I will keep updating it as people submit the .caustic file.
Mike
Don't forget to send me pics or photos of you working on your tracks..... The more I get from you guys, the more I can add to the video version of the final product.
I'm working on a track myself..... Just messin' around with some other stuff while I keep my third eye on this thread...
I wrote this because of my understanding of your previous comments.
I guess you are concerned that we will be at each other's throats if we do not agree each other and the project will fail. I think you see it too much from a professional view and your focus is to make it perfect.
But maybe I've missunderstood you...
https://soundcloud.com/gharwen
>I guess you are concerned that we will be at each other's throats if we do not agree each other and the project will fail. I think you see it too much from a professional view and your focus is to make it perfect.
You should take his wisdom as a blessing.
ＭＹ ＭＵＳＩＣ
Here's my track fellow Warriors.
Take it away DrBolus!
Caustic Song file (optional):
Google Play! | Facebook | YouTube!
Can I send you video too? It's nothing spectacular, but it does represent work on this project.
Google Play! | Facebook | YouTube!
Okay, coolbeans! I see where this is going..... sweet so far
I just sent you the media files using https://www.wetransfer.com/ so check your junk mail or spam folder for it too, in case you dont see the email.
Google Play! | Facebook | YouTube!
got it, thx!
I think for fun I am going to wait until James (#10) posts his file so i won't have anything preconceived in mind
On it like a car bonnet
Have a little listen to my work.
https://soundcloud.com/drbolus
https://www.facebook.com/drbolus
FYI, For those wondering what wardini is talking about, I swapped him the 11th track for what I am working on right now.
You all will have the Caustic metadata app soon (little in IDE screenshot of the app prototype).
Mike
No HQ album art? and what rom is that?
ＭＹ ＭＵＳＩＣ
No, this is for the descriptor data Rej added for a .caustic file. Ask him if you would be able to embed image bytes into it for album art.
He might have a problem with that(copyright issues maybe?), never know though...
Edit: And the rom? Its the Android 4.3 SDK. The look and feel will be whatever is installed on your device.
Mike
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